It’s December 13th. On this day in 2011, Donald Trump wrote a letter announcing that he was bowing out of moderating (!) a Newsmax presidential debate.

Jody and Niki are joined by James Poniewozik of the New York Times to discuss Trump’s flirtation with both moderating a debate and running for president, and how the conservative media ecosystem has evolved over the last 10 years.

James’s latest book is “Audience of One.” Nikki’s book i “Messengers of the Right.”

Find a transcript of this episode at: https://tinyurl.com/esoterichistory

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