Dr. Michael Kimmel, author of the NYT bestselling Guyland, speaks with Andy to discuss boys, men, and everything in between. Masculinity doesn’t have to be “toxic” but the way we teach (or don’t teach) our boys about what it means to be a “man” has dire consequences for us all.

Full show notes

“Boys will be boys,” right? Unfortunately, the playing field of masculinity in society today is more dangerous than you might believe. From hazing gone wrong, to depression and suicide, to jail time, the consequences of not understanding masculinity and what it means to be a man can be dire. It can literally be a matter of life or death for some.

Not only are young men harming others by learning harmful behaviors, such as not processing emotions and being overly aggressive, but they’re also hurting themselves. They’re limiting themselves by acting in ways that were dictated to them by media, pop culture, their peers, and older men who perpetuate a “traditional” sense of masculinity.

Growing into adulthood is hard enough for anyone, but there can be a particularly toxic mindset when it comes to teenage boys. Leaving our teenage boys and young men completely unchecked is not a healthy way to raise them. When boys transition into manhood in their late teens, they’re forced to figure out what it means to “be a man” on their own. The late high school, college, and early adult years are perceived to be a proving ground for young men, and they’ll go out of their way to show off their machismo in order to be accepted by their friends.

These rituals, such as hazing and initiations into social groups, have become dangerous, harmful, and completely unnecessary elements of masculinity in society today. Binge drinking, experimenting with illicit substances, and physically dangerous tasks are usually dictated to them by their peers or by other young men who are only a year or so older than they are. And no one is talking about manhood, so the question remains: what does it mean to be a man?

This is an important question for any parent raising a young man. For the answers, I turned to Michael Kimmel, the man to reference when it comes to understanding men. Author of Guyland: The Perilous World Where Boys Become Men and books on masculinity and gender, Kimmel is dedicated to dissecting the world boys grow up in and revealing how and why boys are impacted by the idea of “manhood.”

Trying to Define Manhood

In this week’s interview, Kimmel notes that at the beginning of the 20th century, there was a clear cut distinction between when someone was a child and when someone was an adult, and that distinction usually came at 14 years old. They went straight to work as an apprentice, assisting in their family business, or if they had the means, left home to pursue higher education.

Today, the transition from child to adult is not as quick. The term “adolescence” was coined to describe the gradual process of growing into adulthood, starting at about 14 and continuing into one’s early twenties. Kimmel claims adolescence and early manhood have blended together. Because of the lack of a clear demarcation between “young boy” and “young man”, masculinity in society today has turned this stage of youth into an unstructured, unsupervised playground to show off their “manliness”.

Kimmel notes that when it comes to parenting boys, parents often take a hands-off approach. Although there is a sense of freedom given, young boys experience a sense of being lost and unsure of the road ahead. This is particularly true in American culture where young men are “self-governing.” Kimmel notices that it's usually the younger men, such as the team captain or the president of the fraternity house, who call the shots within their peer group. Young American men don’t have the same positive influence from masculinity in society today compared to other cultures and countries.

Without learned guidance from older, more experienced men, young men often learn harmful tropes about masculinity in society today from porn, movies, and pop culture because those are the most accessible mediums to gather information from. It’s crucial for adults—especially parents—to step in and guide young men on this journey and influence them in an empowering, positive manner so they don’t hurt themselves or others in the process of growing into adulthood.

Consequences of Toxic Masculinity

In our conversation, Kimmel deconstructs the concept of masculinity in society today and lays it bare. Young men are traditionally taught to be in control. When they feel emasculated, they feel they have to reestablish their status in order to regain respect and control of a situation. This is known as the “alpha male” mentality.

The “alpha” mentality is a slippery slope and can lead into truly unsavory and dangerous ways of expressing masculinity in society today. Specifically, toxic masculinity leads to a sense of entitlement, and entitlement feeds into other toxic ways of thinking, such as racism, sexism, and nationalism. Tune in to this week’s episode to hear Michael and I discuss at length how masculinity in society today has created a sense of entitlement in young men.

When insecure men feel threatened by women in the workforce, the men assert their dominance by acting out in ways that are misogynistic and unfair. Why? Because insecure men feel entitled to being the sole presence in a company or even in an entire industry. The mere presence of women threatens their grip of control

This sense of entitlement bleeds into the issue of race and nationality when it comes to masculinity in society today. When insecure men feel threatened by the presence of immigrants, they act out by saying things like “This is my country” and “Go back to where you came from.” This stems from a toxic sense of entitlement to a country and what they believe to be their rightful land. Insecure men feel like the presence of “outsiders” threatens and challenges their power and sense of control.

Let’s face it, men have been in control for the longest and have benefitted the most. It’s important to teach teenage boys and young men that although there is nothing wrong with embracing your manliness, masculinity in society today should go hand in hand with using your strength as young men to help lift others instead of break people down.

Kimmel argues that the norm for masculinity in society today is to encourage breaking others down in order to only build themselves up. Another topic we touched on is about hazing and how the basis of hazing is humiliation. If young men used as much of their strength to empower their peers instead of break them down, the world would probably be a different place.

How do I Teach Positive Masculinity?

When raising children, you want them to be compassionate, fair, and honest people. And that goes for everyone, no matter their gender. When it comes to raising young boys who will eventually become young men, it’s imperative to instill respect and kindness in them. This week’s episode explores ways to do exactly that.

Embracing masculinity is not a bad thing. There are so many ways to positively influence and uplift teenage boys and young men. However, there is work that has to be done to unlearn toxic, misogynistic, homophobic, and other generally prejudiced ways of thinking that have been normalized. Michael Kimmel and his research is ...