In this live interview, Recode's Kara Swisher talks with former Cambridge Analytica COO Julian Wheatland, early Facebook investor Roger McNamee, and the director and writer of the new Netflix documentary The Great Hack — Karim Amer and Pedro Kos. Then, later in the show, Recode’s Jason Del Rey explores the origins of Amazon Prime, why it’s so effective at keeping us locked into their ecosystem, and how it became the source of the company’s power.

In this episode:

How Wheatland looks back on the Cambridge Analytica scandal and what went wrong; how Amer and Kos approached the subject to turn it into a documentary; Facebook’s evasion of responsibility; what the filmmakers want to happen as a result of their work; why Wheatland decided to be in the documentary; the “fix it” mentality vs. assigning blame; the fragility of western democracy; Brittany Kaiser, the key character of The Great Hack; how Facebook and Google are like chemical companies in the 1950s; and what's next for the people involved in the film.

More information about Land of the Giants:

Land of the Giants is a new podcast from Recode and the Vox Media Podcast Network about the five major technology companies (Facebook, Apple, Amazon, Netflix, and Google – or “FAANG”) that have reshaped our world. Each season focuses on one of the giants and explores the ways that it’s changed our lives – for better and for worse. The first season is about The Rise of Amazon and is hosted by Recode’s Jason Del Rey. Enjoy this special preview of the first episode, Why You’ll Never Quit Amazon Prime, and subscribe to Land of the Giants for free in your favorite podcast app to hear the rest of the episode and to get new episodes automatically.

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Recode Decode has been nominated for best technology podcast in this year’s People’s Choice Podcast Awards! Cast your vote for Recode Decode at https://www.podcastawards.com/app/signup before July 31st. One vote per category.

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Kara Swisher (@karaswisher), host

Karim Amer (@Karim_Amer33), guest

Julian Wheatland (@JulianWheatland), guest

Roger McNamee (@Moonalice), guest

Erica Anderson (@EricaAmerica), executive producer

Eric Johnson (@HeyHeyESJ), producer

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