When well-meaning parents try to keep kids safe from every possible harm, they might actually be creating more anxious, less capable children. In this conversation recorded live on stage at this year's Aspen Ideas Festival, Kelly talks with Lenore Skenazy, who became known as "America's Worst Mom" after letting her nine-year-old ride the New York subway alone and psychologist Dr. Camilo Ortiz, who developed "Independence Therapy" to treat childhood anxiety through independence rather than avoidance. They explore how protecting kids from distress, disappointment, danger, and discomfort interferes with essential skill-building, why being around our children too much leads to over-parenting and how simple changes like waiting five seconds before jumping in to help can make a huge difference. The conversation covers practical strategies for fostering independence, the importance of mixed-age play and the hopeful news that 11 states have now passed laws protecting parents' rights to raise free-range kids.

Special thanks to The Aspen Ideas Festival where this episode was recorded.

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