We discuss Malcolm's theory that men have two overlapping sexual strategies evolutionarily encoded - a "raider" sexuality activated by porn/hookups and a "homesteader" one for long-term partners. By better understanding this bifurcation, men can avoid incorporating unhealthy Raider aspects as their identity. Roleplaying with a wife may satisfy the Raider side but risks altering her pair bonding.

Malcolm Collins: [00:00:00] there are two major sexual events or strategies that a male can undertake. They can overlap and both be successful within the same individual. That means is that there was likely a push for both strategies to develop within men simultaneously. Yeah. And this leads to my hypothesis that the average man has a Raider sexuality and a homesteader sexuality. And, and so the things that turn them on most when they do with their long term partner may be actually entirely divorced from the things that turn them on most when.

What would activate our Raider sexuality most within the modern world would be pornography. These are women that you have no emotional connection to, you see as entirely disposable. This can cause a lot of problems if a man, when he is young when he's learning what his sexuality is He begins to think that his sexuality is only [00:01:00] comprised of the type of pornography that he's consuming.

If you can genuinely convince a woman's body that she's sleeping with a bunch of different people through this sort of role play, you might be actually triggering the same biological change that happens with her actually sleeping with a lot of people.

Would you like to know more?

Simone Collins: requires some major mental caliber, which only, only men

Malcolm Collins: have. Savona's pointing out that some of our audience doesn't like when we're on the wrong side. I

Simone Collins: see the comments. I hear you people. And I made sure that we

Malcolm Collins: This is, this is the problem with attracting a disproportionately autistic audience.

Is they get annoyed when we're on the wrong side. Well, you

Simone Collins: know what? But

Malcolm Collins: I want to talk about a concept that we have developed since writing The Pragmatist Guide to Sexuality. So all of our theories of human sexuality, this is actually not in the book and we haven't done a test on this yet. When I am done with important projects I'm working on now, I may one day run a test on it or when we have Ayla next on, because we're [00:02:00] booking that now I may try to compel her to include this in one of her future studies.

But it is a concept that I think is really worth discussing on the channel in detail in sort of a dedicated episode as the what do we call it? The dual sexual strategy hypothesis. Okay, yeah, that's a good word for it. Which is to say that, Humans can have multiple sexual strategies pre programmed into them that exist alongside each other.

So, one iteration of this that we do argue for in the Pragmatist Guide to Sexuality. It's how this works in women. So in women, we argue that when a woman goes out there and sleeps with a ton of people, her body undergoes something called a polymorphic change. So polymorphic changes happen in animals.

The quintessential example of this is the grasshopper changing into a locust. If you, so in nature, this happens when it's When it gets over a certain population density but it can be simulated in a lab [00:03:00] by rubbing its hind leg with a Q tip and it leads to a behavioral change. It starts this swarming behavior.

It also changes its color, shape, and size. So, pretty big change. But in primates, we see this in baboons, depending on like the resources the baboons have versus the troop size. They will change their social structure. So, I think it's like in, in resource dense areas it, it, it, versus resource scarce areas, they switch between larger social groups that are matriarchal versus large, smaller social groups that are patriarchal or some inverse of that.

But it's a pretty significant change in how they structure themselves. Well, in humans human females specifically, what we argue in the book, and I believe Pretty strongly is that the more a human woman sleeps around the lower, like there were some studies done on this, the lower amounts of oxytocin she will produce with every first time new sexual partner, meaning that she is less likely.

To have an automatic bond to that sexual partner which [00:04:00] is very useful in a monogamous society meaning that they basically automatically fall in love with the first person they have sex with to, to some small extent, and then to a smaller, you know, the second person, third person, but once they're on like person five, this effect no longer happens at all.

And it's going to have a lot of problems in the dating market when women expect men that they are sleeping with, like on guy 10, to ever be able to recapture the spark they had with their first few p Romantic partners, which is often just impossible with women, not always. I mean, obviously, you know, most men are born being attracted to the female body shape, but some men are born being attracted to the male body shape, you know, as in women, some women don't have this effect happen to them, but I think it happens with the majority of women.

And this is actually a very useful thing from a biological context. So it meant that if you were a woman and you were in a monogamous culture, you would be optimized for the monogamous lifestyle. If you were in a culture where you were being passed around, i. e. your village had been raided, or you were raided.

ex slave of some sort then you [00:05:00] would be biologically optimized for that circumstance. However, this is a trend I've noticed that we didn't mention in the book with the dual female hypothesis. I have noticed that women who sleep around more seem to be more in to what I would call the category of arousal patterns that I call violent submission.

This is things like choking, spanking, degradation, stuff like that. Anyone must have

Simone Collins: data on this because I think she tracks body count plus, of course, things that turn people on.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So this is something that we could look at to see if there's a correlation there, but I'm. Fairly certain you're going to end up finding a correlation there with the more partners a woman is sleeping with, the more they are turned on because they are beginning to be optimized, like biologically, for being a slave.

That's what they think they are. They think they are an ex slave that is being passed around some group that has raided and captured her village. This is something that happened very, very, frequently [00:06:00] in a historical context. So frequently in, if you read the pragmatist guide to sexuality, we talk about all the places you see this in behavioral patterns.

So you can see it's pretty deeply carved into our DNA. But Simone, do you want to speak to this at all? No, well,

Simone Collins: this is all stuff we've talked about before. So I'm more interested in hearing you go over the male side of this, which is not in the pragmatist guide to sexuality in which you have.

Malcolm Collins: Come up with.

Well, no, something we haven't talked about it before is the hypothesis that women who sleep around more are going to be more turned on by a violent degradation. I don't, I don't

Simone Collins: predict that with the same confidence that you do.

Malcolm Collins: The next hypothesis is I was thinking like if evolution was going to. Like for something, there are two major sexual events or strategies that a male can undertake.

And it's very important to understand that males can undertake both simultaneously and historically the successful males almost always undertook both simultaneously. [00:07:00] Okay. So a lot of people see like, okay, so there's two different strategies. You as a guy can go out and do a bunch of great being as a warrior, like going out and, and.

Conquering areas go a Viking in a historic context or in Rome, like go out with legions. Right. And end up impregnating a bunch of people within the areas that you conquer. And that can lead to, you know, famously King is gone, right? Like, tons and tons and tons and tons of offspring. But then the other strategy and the, the often more default, like it's almost sort of like a overlapping K and R selecting strategy.

K versus R selecting is, are you investing a lot of time in your offspring? Are you investing a little time in your offspring? Well, the same legionary may have a wife back at home, you know, think about the movie gladiator or whatever, right? Like, he would still have his plot back at home where he had eight kids on the farm and he would be working to help that family.

Well, the fact that these two sexual strategies in men can overlap was in the same successful male. And this is true, like going a [00:08:00] Viking, like if I'm going a Viking and I'm out there and I. have an impulse which causes me to impregnate people when I am raiding a village in northern England, right? I would need a completely different set of impulses to ensure that I both find a, a high quality partner for, who is my stable partner, who's keeping my farm running, who's providing me with food when I get back from a biking, that is taking care of the kids that are going to inherit my family name and everything like that, right?

You have two strategies here. They can overlap and both be successful within the same individual. That means is that there was likely a push for both strategies to develop within men simultaneously. Yeah. And this leads to my hypothesis that men have, your average man, obviously, you know, as I said, some men are gay, so there's all sorts of like little weird ways a guy can be programmed.

Maybe a guy only has one of these appear in him. But I think that the average man has a [00:09:00] Raider sexuality and a homesteader sexuality. And, and so the things that turn them on most when they do with their long term partner may be actually entirely divorced from the things that turn them on most when.

What would activate our Raider sexuality most within the modern world would be pornography. These are women that you have no emotional connection to, you see as entirely disposable. And it would explain why in pornography you see such violent slash hardcore pornography appearing. Because that pornography is, is always, or pornography more generally, is always appealing to the Raider side of a male sexuality.

Interesting. Ciao. This can cause a lot of problems if a man, when he is young and is not sexually successful because he, he doesn't get any, you know, long term partners, he doesn't get any women who he's sleeping with that he respects and a part [00:10:00] of his brain sees as homesteader sexuality. So, when he's learning what his sexuality is He begins to think that his sexuality is only comprised of the type of pornography that he's consuming.

And this leads to men beginning to personally identify and build into their personal narrative of who they are as a person. This violent sexual raider personality. Instead of what they actually are, which is a bifurcation of two sexual personalities with one sexual personality actually be actually being much more optimized for like the good stay at home wife that they should be looking for.

Simone Collins: So basically like arbitrarily. limiting themselves because they see the thing X turns them on and they're totally not realizing that thing Y can also be like a major source of satisfaction for them. But because it's not really in the material that they consume freely and easily online, [00:11:00] they just assume that that's not for them or they don't even know that it's an option.

Wow. Yeah. I mean, it's a lot harder to market that kind of fantasy to men. I mean, it's, it's certainly not like immediately satisfying, right? It's this slow burn. It's a, it's a different.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. But I think a lot of men who, when they're younger, find themselves turned on by radar sexuality type stuff might be surprised how gross that stuff would feel doing with their long term partner.

No, it is, it is interesting. Because I think that they just assume, Oh, this is all stuff I would always. Enjoy doing. And, and then they get it. Well, and so men can high simulate Raider sexuality was long term partners through scene changes. And this is an interesting thing that you see within BDSM and stuff like that.

So what's happening there is they are learning to think of their partner as somebody disposable was in the context of a micro scene that disconnects them [00:12:00] from who they are.

Simone Collins: So you're no longer my wife. You're now this victim and I'm,

Malcolm Collins: you know, you're now like a nurse. You're now a, you know, whatever, but that would actually be an authority mindset.

So that's actually the inverse of what I'm talking about here. But this is role play. Like we are role playing a scenario in which you aren't who you are. And I am not who I am so that we can both carry out something that masturbates this. Part of our sexuality that is not being fully masturbated was in the normal sort of sexual relationship I would have with somebody I know that I'm married to.

Right. Yeah.

Simone Collins: Yeah. Because like, no, no man would really want to see violent and bad things happen to his wife or like, you know, a, a coercive scenario take place. I mean, unless he's really weird. Yeah. But like, but most husbands would be like, no, not my wife, but they may still be turned on by that scenario.

So they would need

Malcolm Collins: to like disassociate. Relationship. They're like, how do I simulate both of the women who historically I would have [00:13:00] been pillaging their village and also simulate the loving relationship I have at a home. Well, let's do it with scene changes, set changes and pretend because humans can pretend.

Right. And they can trigger different aspects of their personality by appearing in very different one, like costumes using different words. Like this is something that you often, you know, we talk about humans having different parts of their personality overlaid on each other that are brought out. Like when I'm at work, one aspect of my personality is out when I'm at home, one aspect of my personality is out.

And when people go back to their families, I think they often find a more juvenile aspect of their personality is drawn out, even if they don't intend for it to be because it's the scene and the context of the people that are around reactivate. This, this earlier optimization that they had in life.

Well, I think within sexuality, we have different ones as well and that they can be activated by very specific context. The problem is, is that when people begin to internalize, this is something we constantly emphasize within the pragmatist guide to sexuality. And it's really important to [00:14:00] note is that the things that arbitrarily turn you on.

Are not who you are, like they are not a reflection of your personality or anything like that. They are random reality

Simone Collins: or what you want to have happen or what you endorse. Yeah. Anything. Yeah.

Malcolm Collins: A woman who gets turned on by, you know, the course of sex. Yeah. Coercive sex. That doesn't mean that she wants a surprise sex, right?

There is a difference between something turning you on and you wanting it in the real world. There's also a difference between something randomly turning you on and it being an aspect of your identity. Now, I know that this is A horrifying and offensive thing for me to say was in this world of alphabet soup identities, right?

That just because something turns you on doesn't mean you need to incorporate it into your identity or you need to act on it. But I think that actually, the rise of the alphabet soup mentality has led [00:15:00] to many men who may not agree, like, like, like, they are otherwise normal straight men, to begin to accidentally Incorporate a lot of this Raider sexuality into their personality because they're not getting laid when they're developing their sexual identity.

And so they're seeing all women in this way. By the way, a clip I really wanted to use about the alphabet soup group because I you know, going extinct because they're not going to be a long term group. Like the populations that are really, really accepting of them have incredibly low fertility rates.

Mr. Marsh, what exactly are you trying to accomplish? We have to take matters into our own hands.

We're trying to turn everyone gay so that there are no future humans. Present day America, number one.

 And it, it reminds me because I'm like, that's basically what many of the anti natalists are doing is a, is a big gay orgy to prevent humanity or at least their sect of humanity from existing in the future.

Malcolm Collins: And that is historically also why many cultures. Shame these sorts of relationships is it's not that these relationships are intrinsically immoral and I believe very strongly that like gay relationships are not [00:16:00] intrinsically immoral, but I also believe that groups that are accepting of them to have lower fertility rates and thus get outcompeted by groups that are not.

And that is why pretty much wherever you go, if you're looking at a successful, like, long lived widespread cultural group, it's going to have some undertone of homophobia. Because those iterations of cultures outcompete other iterations of cultures intergenerationally. And, and only within our debauched modern context do you see anything else.

But I mean, equally debauched is succumbing to or identifying with this raider sexuality. Just because something turns you on doesn't mean you need to incorporate it into your identity. And Or that it's a good thing.

Simone Collins: Like you have to think about your morals and your values and what you want for society and yourself and others.

And then you need to think about what turns you on and maybe, maybe parse those

Malcolm Collins: out. Well, I know what I mean. Some men they may think, or women may have such a strong desire to exercise this aspect of their sexuality that was hard coded in BOSE. It makes sense to do BOSE within a relationship, to have your BDSM play and your regular sexual [00:17:00] relationship or vanilla sexual relationship.

That may make sense to overlap. To lower incidence of marital dissatisfaction which might lower the chance of your wife cheating on you with somebody outside of your relationship because you are taking on both roles in this artificial context for them. And that is a really interesting phenomenon that that may be a successful way to structure things for some communities.

Why? I don't think that that works. Why? Why do you think? I don't think that that'll work long term.

Simone Collins: Because it's an unsustainable power dynamic?

Malcolm Collins: No, because I don't see it in any long lived cultural group in the world. Hmm. I am aware of no cult, long lived religious tradition or long lived cultural tradition that has a bifurcation of how they treat their partners.

And i. e. we have both the, the homestead relationship and the raider relationship. And the reason I think that you don't see [00:18:00] this is because I think that once you begin to treat women in this raider fashion, they are likely going to have the same biological reaction that they have from being passed around between a ton of guys.

Okay, so they'll

start

Simone Collins: devaluing the relationship. As well,

Malcolm Collins: they'll biologically begin to transform. If you can genuinely convince a woman's body that she's sleeping with a bunch of different people through this sort of role play, you might be actually triggering the same biological change that happens with her actually sleeping with a lot of people.

It could be. I mean, people

Simone Collins: get into, like, really into character. Like. Totally, yeah, I, I, wow, I wonder if it could, yeah, trigger the sort of hormonal process, is it?

Malcolm Collins: So that's why I suspect we don't see this in long lived cultural groups, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't make sense within a modern relationship.

If you are with a woman who has not, who has, sorry, you're with a woman who has slept around a lot, this might be the only way. to maintain her happily was in a long term monogamous relationship. [00:19:00] Because she has already undergone this polymorphic transformation. And I don't know if there's a way to transform women back.

Okay, but

Simone Collins: here's the thing, and I think this is important to note, is that relationships are not just sex. Like true, there's a lot more that's going on. There's, there's economic burden sharing, there's building households, there's raising kids. Yeah, I think a lot of people get married, especially when they're more mature and of course there are many exceptions here.

Independent of sex because they want to do specific things like it. And there are many, probably totally sexless marriages out there where couples have just come together because they knew that that configuration would help them achieve their lifestyle

Malcolm Collins: goals. Well, yeah, I mean, and I think we largely as a society right now overvalue sex within marriages and The reason we overvalue sex was in marriages is because when we are thinking about marriage partners within our existing Sociotechnological framework [00:20:00] people vet marriage partners through casual sex and so Your quality as a marriage partner is in part seen as your value is in sexual marketplaces.

And so people then confuse that as being a core aspect of a marriage when in reality, I, and I, and I think, you know, we had this video on how girl defined ruined a generation of men. There's a takeoff on the house, Scott Pilgrim ruined a generation of men.

PVD and Ecstasy conceded with no self-esteem. She's a teammate dream if you hate yourselF.

enough flowers and fell So impacted,

Hollywood It's sad to picture someone's daughter Like a lamb to the slaughter

Malcolm Collins: In that they convinced conservatives that the point of marriage was sex, but that the way you got the very [00:21:00] best sex and the very goodest of good sex went through abstinence until marriage when that missed the point, abstinence until marriage was a value because sex is just not that important at all before a marriage or after a marriage in terms of our own kids.

And you can watch our video on how we would you know, teach our kids about sexuality. I, I do think that sex can be used as a tool within a modern context to you know, get followers and help and stuff like that. I mean, who knows how I would have done in college without all the women who helped me with my homework and studying that were primarily doing that because I was having sex with them.

Like, there, there, there are men and women who use sex as a resource to reach certain goals that they have. It's just better if our kids grow up understanding the costs and the benefits of that. Now, fortunately, it's been Maybe at least for me, fortunately, not always, because you know, you could accidentally get a woman pregnant or something like that.

But the costs, at least at a long term psychological level, seem to be lower than the cost to women. A [00:22:00] really interesting study I was looking at recently was looking at, and I'll put the statistics on screen here, how many sexual partners a woman had had before she got married and the likelihood that the marriage would end a divorce.

And a woman A woman who hadn't had any sexual partners, there was only a 20 percent chance it would end in divorce. And a woman who had had, I think, over 15 sexual partners or over 12 sexual partners, there was only a 20 percent chance the marriage would stay. And this is a huge difference. This is a huge difference.

Simone Collins: Oh, I think most women like when I think about Ayla's live Twitter polls, so like, you know, we actually had the opportunity to see people sort themselves by number of sexual partners. It seemed like most women in Ayla's live Twitter polls sorted themselves into the. three to eight range. So,

Malcolm Collins: you know, Yeah.

Well, so in the oxytocin studies, that would be pretty much already near the floor of oxytocin you get from new partners. That seems to happen after [00:23:00] three. So once you've done three partners, you're pretty much spent on the oxytocin category but you would still see a decline in the probability that a marriage continues.

And I should note these oxytocin studies. I remember very clearly going over them. I remember them being controversial. Like it was talked about them being controversial, but they were there and I went over them. Now, if you look for them online, you won't find them anywhere. And what's funny is all of the old sex researchers remember them.

You know, when we're talking with Diana Fleischman, she remembers these studies existing. You can't find them anywhere anymore. I do not know what happened to them. Lev will remember them existing at some point. Just gone now, scrubbed from the internet. Which I think shows the power of The, the, the leftist distortion field when something doesn't agree with their narrative or leads to unpleasant implications, it must be destroyed which to me is interesting in that it shows that this war that we have as a war of truth and integrity and fighting for what is real and fighting for this society wide distortion field that is meant to [00:24:00] protect the illusion that everyone can live in this, this happy world.

In fact, it, it reminds me a lot of this book I read growing up called The Giver. I don't know if you read that one, where basically they'd even removed colors from society and they'd removed everything. So you took a drug that made it so you didn't feel emotions, you didn't see colors, you didn't Anything like that, because all of that stuff could lead to potential discomfort in some individuals, and the goal of society is to remove all potential discomfort.

And, and we are beginning to see that, this expanding distortion field, but fortunately we're also seeing them be incredibly low fertility, and so they really can only survive by taking children from nearby healthy demographic groups. So, you know, And then people are like, well, why is all this sex?

Why do you look so hard at sex? Like, why is it so important to you to understand, right? Sexuality right now is one of the core ways that the mind virus is utilizing to peel kids out from your healthy demographic groups. If you ignore human sexual diversity or real human sexuality, [00:25:00] then you put your group at risk of having kids peeled out of it.

If you do stupid things like banning pornography within a modern context, like, of course pornography was a good idea to ban in a historic context. When You know, people the first person they married, what, the first person they had sex with was who they married and porn just lowered the amount of sex they were having with their partner, right?

Like, yeah, of course that made sense. But if you look within a modern context, there's pretty much a direct correlation geographically with how religious, i. e. how banned porn is in an area and how much porn is consumed. Banning porn has the exact opposite effect at a cultural level that you would expect, which means we need to understand human sexuality to learn how we can adapt our cultures Cheers.

to better prevent sexuality as being a wedge that the left can use or the, the, the mind virus can use to take our children from us. And I think being sexually accepting while also being sexually honest, the cool thing about what the left has done is they've created such a distortion field. It's really [00:26:00] clear when you talk to people about how human sexuality actually works, the, and you look at our book, like the pragmatist guide to sexuality, which would be very offensive from a leftist perspective.

They are getting a truer understanding of sexuality than the left is selling because the left, as we talked about in the beginning of that book, it has to sell this iteration of sexuality where gayness is like a meaningful sexual subtype, right? And we pointed out that if gayness probably doesn't really meaningfully exist, it's better to think of what specific genital configurations humans are most attracted to, because we point out that it's actually pretty common for straight men to be repulsed by something like vagina.

It's actually pretty common for men to be attracted to, like, a female body shape, like, secondary sex characteristics, but male primary sex characteristics, which within the online sphere is known as, like, FUDA it's, it's, within women, you see similar sort of mismatch between, like, primary and secondary sex characteristics, first attraction to the extent where, like Categorizing people into this, like, holistically, I am attracted to the opposite [00:27:00] same category is really only useful in a macro behavioral pattern perspective, i.

e., who are they dating? Which it

Simone Collins: is useful Well, almost even more relevant from a cultural standpoint, really.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, they're groups that built an identity because they were This is communicated from society for a similar rule violation, but this led for something like gay people to be in the same community as trans people, when in reality they have almost nothing in common in that they, other than that they were both isolated from mainstream society for violating sexual norms or gender norms and it really makes no sense for these two communities to be allies at all, other than for a while their goals overlapped, which I do not think that they do anymore.

I guess

Simone Collins: allied in, you know, oppression or minority status.

Malcolm Collins: Well, no, they were allied in how they were separated from society, which led to them. Any group that is separated from society in any way is going to begin to develop new cultural norms. And those cultural norms begin to develop an [00:28:00] intercommunity identity.

And so they begin to. Develop a culture around the reason they were excommunicated from society, which then meant the reason that they were excommunicated from society ended up becoming like their highest order of identity. But it didn't exist in a meaningful, like when you actually look at the data, it's actually like far more nuanced than that.

Like the Kinsey scale is completely garbage. Read the pragmatist guide to sexuality or see our video on this. Like it. That is not the way human sexuality works at all. But and again, we're not saying that there aren't a huge portion of men who are also attracted to men or women who are also attracted to women.

I would say that within bisexual populations, when you actually look at the data like on dating platforms, they actually like will overwhelmingly prefer to date. Just one gender. And this may be a very strong preference you're seeing within the bisexual population, or it may mean that a lot of the attacks on the bisexual population are actually accurate.

But it typically, for example, within men, only 20 percent of bisexuals actually, like, do that, whereas in women it's something like 35%, so it's actually unmeaningful. I was actually surprised within women, [00:29:00] so many bisexual women are actually really just only dating one gender or the other gender. Which you can see, but apparently they switch up as well, which men don't do as much.

Like, they're really persistent on which their preferable gender is. Although you do see within the bisexual community, interesting, a lot of them leaving around the age where they might be getting scared that they're not going to be able to have kids. Um, so, so you have all that, but this has led to this leftist distortion field around how they're able to do sexual research, which means that you and me and, and, and within things like the pragmatist guide to sexuality we are able to have discussions.

That are truer. And obviously truer to young people than the discussions that are happening in the left. And when they see that, that completely prevents the left from being able to use sexuality as a wedge to take them out of our cultural groups. But this requires actually engaging with sexuality and understanding why we had some of these historic practices, like the denigration of porn.

Asking why we would study this stuff so diligently or [00:30:00] spend so much time researching it is like asking a prisoner why they would spend so much time researching the bars of their cage. If we are trapped in these fleshy prisons that enforce Emotions and desires upon us we did not ask for. It is in part our duty to study and understand them so that we can better escape them and better prevent them from controlling and influencing our actions. If you were trapped in a room with a wild, dangerous animal, the goal of any righteous individual is to ensure that this wild animal This lower part of themselves doesn't become the core focus of their lives and identity, but there are multiple paths towards achieving that, for example, you can spend every waking moment attempting to tame and control the beast, or you can learn to feed it just enough to keep it from bothering you.

and through better understanding the Beast, we can better understand how to deprioritize it in terms of [00:31:00] our daily thoughts and actions.

Malcolm Collins: Now that the left You know, tracer butt scandal. Gamergate has seeded male sexuality. We are insane for not picking that up. They said anything that turns on males is intrinsically immoral basically. And now we can go scoop up the, the remains of that, which is a large part of the, the, the male community, right?

Because they don't like. Being denigrated for what turns them on and incorporate that was more traditional frameworks in a way that these two things can work together and they can work together, but they work together because it is true that going out and sleeping with a lot of people is probably not in your best interest.

When you look at the data and, and that's, that's the great thing about all of this is that because what we're fighting for is truth, truth is always on our side. Convenient. Convenient. Very convenient. Well, no, I mean, if they only were fighting with integrity and for actually protecting people, then truce would be on their side as well, but they're not.

Yeah, but I mean,

Simone Collins: it [00:32:00] also gives us flexibility that other groups don't have, which is to say if we get better evidence, we get to just say, oh, sorry, we were wrong. And, and then pursue what we understand to be right given the evidence. So I think the greatest thing about the fighting for truth stance is that it's okay to be wrong.

It's actually really important to learn when you're wrong so that you can be less wrong and more right going forward. And then no matter how. You know, imperfect. Our knowledge is we can always try to do a little bit better and get closer to the truth, whereas other groups are just kind of stuck with their stances.

But I'm really, really glad you shared this theory with me. I do. I don't know. I wonder like how societies could change culturally in a way that would prepare men to understand this bifurcation because there's a lot of things like we discussed in another conversation recently. Yeah, How like both men and women really aren't really taught to bring anything to the table.

So is it no wonder that [00:33:00] even with all these different government incentives and programs, men and women are being still completely disinterested in getting married. And it's easy to, you know, sort of through propaganda, education, et cetera, explain again and again, you here's what you can bring to the table.

Always keep in mind what you need to bring to the table. But how would you train people around this? How would you prepare young men? around

Malcolm Collins: this. Just make them aware of this truth. The thing that turns them on with porn is not necessarily what's going to turn them on with a long term partner. It's kind of a sex ed thing.

You shouldn't incorporate those things into your identity and also keep in mind that the things that seduce women in bars are not the things that seduce the good long term partner that you want to be married to for the rest of your life. These are two different sexual optimization functions. And if you waste a bunch of time optimizing around the wrong one, you will get divorce scraped.

Hmm.

Simone Collins: All right. Good. Solid advice. [00:34:00] I love you. Malcolm.

Malcolm Collins: I love you too, Simone. You're an amazing woman and I am desperately lucky that I married somebody so clear headed and intelligent and that helps me see the world more clearly every day. And so thank you for that.

Simone Collins: Hopefully more so when I don't have a fever anymore, thanks for taking care of me.

You're the best.

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