The rise of artificial intelligence will bring about an irreversible, planetary-scale shift in human life and politics. But for all the grand pronouncements from techno-utopians and pessimists alike, the reality is that there's still much to be decided about the future that AI portends. At the forefront of those investigations is Marek Poliks, a composer, theorist and co-host of the Disintegrator podcast, where he and Roberto Alonso explore the frontiers of human-AI relations with guests from all disciplines. He joins Richard Hames to talk about what's next for AI now that it's ingested the entire internet, how the concept of 'lift' helps us understand how AI will impact capitalism, and why there's no point asking if AI is capable of 'creativity'. Marek and Roberto's book, Choreomata: Performance and Performativity After AI, is published by CRC/Taylor and Francis. Help us build people-powered media: https://novara.media/support