"What Israel is doing right now has nothing to do with antisemitism. What Israel is doing right now is a genocide. What Israel has been doing for the past 75 years is apartheid, is occupation. There is no need for any one of us to serve in the IDF. The IDF should not exist. The state of Israel should not exist." These are the words of a former Israeli soldier turned anti-Zionist organizer: Meital Yaniv. Meital describes themself as a "death laborer tending to a prayer for the liberation of the land of Palestine" and has recently written the book Bloodlines which traces their paternal lineage being survivors of the Holocaust and subsequently migrating to Palestine. From there, Meital traces their lineage through indoctrination into Zionism and as settler-colonists, and defenders of the so-called "state of Israel." Meital then describes their refusal to serve in the IDF and their subsequent departure from Israel and development into a death doula for Zionism and Israel. In this conversation with Meital, we hear about what it's like to be raised "extremely Zionistic" and to serve in the IDF. We learn about the consequences of trauma that is passed down intergenerationally and what is necessary to truly heal individually and collectively. We explore how to talk to people who defend Zionism and the state of Israel and what the tradition of Judaism would say about Zionism and the genocide of the Palestinian people. And finally, Meital offers invitations for how we can all contribute to bringing the state of Israel to an end for the liberation of Palestine. And finally, Meital offers invitations for how we can all contribute to bringing the state of Israel to compassionate just death for the liberation of Palestine. Further resources: Bloodlines by Meital Yaniv Meital Yaniv's website Related episodes: Upstream: Palestine Pt. 1: A Socialist Introduction with Sumaya Awad Upstream: Palestine Pt. 2: Justice for Some with Noura Erakat Upstream: Palestine Pt. 3: Settler-Colonialism and Medical Apartheid with Rupa Marya & Jess Ghannam Upstream: Palestine Pt. 4: False Solutions and Paths of Resistance with Sumaya Awad Upstream: Palestine Pt. 5: The Political Economy of Palestine with Adam Hanieh Upstream: Palestine Pt. 6: One State with Ghada Karmi Upstream: Palestine Pt. 7: Direct Action w/ Max Geller of Palestine Action Upstream: Palestine Pt. 8: Indigeneity and Settler-Colonialism w/ Krystal Two Bulls & Sumaya Awad Upstream: Palestine Pt. 9: Palestine 2031 w/ Nadia Zanghari Donate to Middle Eastern Children's Alliance (MECA) Anera: Provide urgent humanitarian aid to Palestinians Gaza Mutual Aid Intermission music: "Arvoles Yoran Por Luvias (Trees Cry For Rain)" performed by Gloria Levy Upstream is a labor of love — we couldn't keep this project going without the generosity of our listeners and fans. Subscribe to our Patreon at patreon.com/upstreampodcast or please consider chipping in a one-time or recurring donation at www.upstreampodcast.org/support If your organization wants to sponsor one of our upcoming documentaries, we have a number of sponsorship packages available. Find out more at upstreampodcast.org/sponsorship For more from Upstream, visit www.upstreampodcast.org and follow us on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, and Bluesky. You can also subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts.