How much should we care? In this final season episode of Who Cares Wins, Lily explores the overwhelm and grief that can come with climate action. But conversely, if we truly understand the destruction that is taking place, why do we continue with business as usual? Are many of us living in denial? We hear from poet-songwriter Patti Smith about what she learned from the Dalai Lama. Writer Jonathan Safran Foer discusses the emphatic leap required; and film-maker Joshua Oppenheimer shares what he learnt about cognitive dissonance when filming The Act of Killing, and the stories we tell ourselves to justify our actions. Lily also speaks with climate activist and lawmaker Farhana Yamin about her journey to and through eco-grief, and psychologist Julia Samuels discusses her clinical experience of eco-grief and anxiety, and tools we might use to lesson overwhelm. Finally, Wade Davis offers wisdom from Tibet. You can find out more about Farhana Yamin and Jonathan Safran Foer, as well as many of the themes explored in this episode, in Lily’s book, Who Cares Wins, which is out now in hardback, ebook and audiobook.Audible: https://bit.ly/3jwS8UHWaterstones: https://bit.ly/30OsUtrApple: https://apple.co/2XT7TvMWith thanks to the How to Academy for allowing us the use of the interview with Jonathan Safran Foer. How to Academy have their own weekly podcast featuring some of the world's leading thinkers - available to stream from How To Academy dot com or wherever you get your podcasts.www.howtoacademy.com/podcastsAnd thanks to Yeti Television for allowing us the use of the interview with Patti Smith, as well as to Liz Friend, the Producer and Director of the interview. Please find a reading list and more information from our featured guests:Jonathan Safran Foer: https://www.penguin.co.uk/books/310/310101/we-are-the-weather/9780241984918.htmlJoshua Oppenheimer: https://shop.bfi.org.uk/joshua-oppenheimer-12-early-works.htmlJulia Samuels: https://www.waterstones.com/book/this-too-shall-pass/julia-samuel/9780241348864Wade Davis: https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/political-commentary/covid-19-end-of-american-era-wade-davis-1038206/See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.