In this episode, we dive deep into the evolving relationship between engineering and product with Pranab Krishnan, CTO of Zeal - a payroll and payments platform for staffing companies. We explore how the traditional boundaries between engineering, product management, and customer interaction are dissolving, especially in the age of AI. Pranab shares insights on building a product-centric engineering culture, the concept of "shifting left," and how AI tools are reshaping the skills engineers need to succeed.Key Takeaways🎯 Everyone Should Be a Product PersonThe most successful startups foster a culture where engineers, designers, and even operations staff think like product managers and maintain direct connections to customer needs.🤖 AI as the New Abstraction LayerJust like TypeScript abstracted JavaScript complexity, AI will become another abstraction layer. The future belongs to those who master orchestration, architecture, and agency - not just coding.🚀 The Flat Organization FutureTeams will become leaner and flatter, with higher expectations for product surface area. Instead of hiring more engineers, companies will be expected to build more comprehensive platforms with the same team size.⚡ Shift Left PhilosophyEngineers moving closer to business problems and customer interactions, while designers and other roles also expand their responsibilities into traditionally separate domains.🏗️ Core vs. Edge DevelopmentIn regulated industries like fintech, maintain bulletproof core systems while moving fast on user-facing features and interfaces.Timestamped Highlights[01:26] The CTO Evolution Journey[03:44] Building vs. Learning Product SkillsPranab discusses whether product management is learnable or innate, emphasizing that everyone approaches it differently - some from operations, others from technical backgrounds.[06:12] The AI Evolution QuestionDiscussion on whether AI represents an evolution of software engineering or a fundamental paradigm shift away from core coding skills.[07:21] AI as Abstraction"My thesis on this is that everything is an abstraction... We are going to see AI becoming abstraction. The skills that I think people will need over the next five to 10 years is... orchestration... and agency."[10:49] The Backlog ProblemExploring what happens to product backlogs when engineers can produce more through AI assistance, and the potential for engineers to become natural problem-solvers with more time.[15:15] Magic Patterns Tool DiscussionReal-world example of AI design tools that allow rapid UI iteration and prototyping with simple prompts.[21:29] Expertise and AI Questions"You can judge expertise by the types of questions people ask. And I think these tools... it requires a technical person to ask those questions, because you're not gonna know the nuance of if the answer's correct or not."[23:38] The Future Hiring LandscapePrediction that while teams will initially hire fewer engineers, expectations for product complexity will increase, eventually balancing back to similar hiring needs.[25:13] The Data Advantage"The big AI company that's going to do this well is most likely going to be the one who has the most data about you. So OpenAI is already poised... I would not be surprised if OpenAI builds its own Netflix, its own web flow, its own e-commerce."Featured Quote"Intelligence is on tap, but agency is the core of capitalism. Agency is going to be even more important as intelligence is more easily available to us."— Pranab Krishnan, referencing Gary TanTools & Resources MentionedMagic Patterns - AI-powered design tool for rapid UI creationZeal - Payroll and payments platform for staffing companiesClaude Sonnet 3.7 - Referenced for physics simulation capabilitiesY Combinator philosophy on hiringLike this episode? Share it with fellow tech leaders and subscribe for more insights on the intersection of technology, product, and business strategy.